I propose 2024 is the year of early access games boycott.
Bring back completed games only.
Eh, early access isn’t the problem. Palworld has been wrecking Pokemon despite being Early Access
Can 2024 instead be the year of bad game boycott? When an early access game is better than most AAA completed games, then there’s a serious problem
If we could all just agree to not preorder, I’ll negotiate from there.
Preordering made sense when games came in nice boxes, and you wanted to be sure to play it on the day of release instead of waiting for restocking. With digital downloads now which are not limited in quantity it is just stupid.
This, 100%. The only value of preordering is guaranteeing stock of a physical item that threatens to be out of stock if you were to buy it walk-in. In the modern digital age where downloading tens of gigabytes that take up no space, ship near-instantly on demand, and have theoretically infinite supply, preordering is pointless if the actual game itself is all you care about.
i never preorder, and i don’t think i could justify jt even if i did. buying a game for 70 bucks when you don’t even know if it’s any good just sounds stupid to me.
Early Access is a problem when big publishers try to do it. It makes sense that indies do it so they have cash flow at all. Big outlets have funding on hand, but are trying to leverage it, anyway.
Using us as test dummies is still better than releasing an unfinished piece of shit for full price.
kinda like what’s going on with Last Epoch and Diablo IV
May it’s my age, but I feel like d3 was significantly more popular that d4 is.
Since it’s required to be online I’m 100% skipping it.
I’m also Skipping it because they took overwatch 1 away from me. So no more blizzard games until overwatch 1 comes back.
Diabolo 3 is also always online tho.
Not on console, at least.
Is this post not about Palworld?
Now it is
I mean, just do a little due diligence, Jesus. I’ve bought PalWorld, Planet Crafter, Traveler’s Rest, and more in early access and had a blast with all of them. In fact, I’d say it’s some of the best bang for my buck in the last ten years of gaming. I’ve also not bought early access games because the five minutes of due diligence suggested that it was a garbage game.
I particularly think it’s fine with small, indie studios that don’t have a lot of devs or resources. No way in fuck am I buying an early access AAA release.
Couldn’t agree more.
Games like Valheim or Satisfactory have also been great, despite technically still being in early Access. And, looking back, Risk of Rain 2, Hades and Dead Cells developers have all done excellent job at using early access to develop their games and listen to the community.
Early access, just like any other development model, is a tool. All depends on how it is used.
Pocketpair releasing Palworld into Early Access when Craftopia is still in Early Access leaves me with a bad taste in my mouth
Same, I looked at craftopia and thought “palworld is an obvious cash grab”, which it might end up being. I’m glad people are having fun now, but I’m not buying into its future :)
I’ve read they also have a HollowKnight look-alike in the works as well.
The HK ripoff is called “Never grave” and they are stretching their resources thin on three unfinished products simultaneously
Same. I love both, but when I purchased craftopia I was funding the development of craftopia, not palworld. They’re a small company so I kinda get it, but it still has me concerned that they’re not going to properly finish craftopia.
I think it unfortunately just comes down to money. Craftopia wasn’t popular enough to pay the bills to finish it.
We’ll see what happens with palworld. If they abandon it too then we’ll know they’re just scumbags. But if they finish it then we’ll know abandoning craftopia was a financial need.
I can’t say I’ve ever played Craftopia, but after hearing about this I went to the steam page to see for myself. They have released consistent large updates in the last 6 months and even since the launch of Palworld.
Most of the reviews from people who’ve played it mention it’s getting review bombed because of this mis-information and is actually quite good.
Seems to me if they can pull off making two games with multiple teams both which continue to have development, I say more power to them. I’m enjoying Palworld and will at some point check out Craftopia now because of it.
I also saw those updates. I never played it so I usually just cede that they abandoned it for the sake of argument.
I agree with you though
Right? People need to take a little responsibility. If you want early access, expect issues. If you don’t want to see issues, wait. Easy. What’s the point complaining about a company providing early access or other gamers purchasing it? You don’t need to make it your business, just don’t buy the game yet if it bothers you.
Yep. The indie boom that PC gaming experienced would not have been possible without early access funding, full stop.
Not every early access title has gone perfectly and there are some studios that have gamed the system.
Still, the stuff that managed to make it through the process and become successful has been some of the only stuff saving us from a live service hellscape
Satisfactory I bought for 30 dollars 4 years ago and it’s sitting at 1,600 hours for me. I think sweeping general statements are really the bad guy here
the journey of this game is wild.
it was super fun from the get go years ago, but somehow every single update made it better and better.
i haven’t seen a game with such a focus on quality of life updates before. that team is glorious
My rule is that it has to be an enjoyable experience in the game’s current state. Factorio was fantastic years before it left early access. I bought Space Engineers practically as soon as it hit, before there was even proper weapons in the game, and I had a blast building space ships.
I’m holding off on Palworld. I’m sure what’s there is enjoyable for many people, but I’d like to see the endgame fleshed out a bit first.
It’d be nice, if those AAA games were at least marked as early access instead of just being released and sold as something finished. But yes, you’re correct.
Eh, I bought Grounded in Early Access. Maye by Obsidian and backed by Microsoft. I think this should count as AAA. Also I think you don’t mean that “small, indie studio” cause those are few and far between. Sons of the Forest? They have a Publisher (literally the opposite of being independent). I think there are lots of games which you have put into that category that are not actually indie devs at all. Anyway, my point is just that it’s not a black and white issue.
The games I have bought in early access:
- Kerbal Space Program
- Factorio
- Satisfactory
- Subnautica
Early access isn’t the problem.
Minecraft.
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Dwarf Fortress has only gotten better though, and it started great.
Was just gonna say I’ve put an embarrassing amount of hours into Satisfactory, which is an “early access” game I paid like $20 for. Nothing wrong with it. It’s not an abandoned product, but even if it was I’d have a hard time complaining about it.
I have 1000 hours in Satisfactory. And there’s a LOT currently wrong with it. Tons of bugs, incomplete mechanics, performance issues, and it got worse in Update 8 not better because of the engine update.
That said, the team is working on it, Coffee Stain will get it ironed out and release a solid v1.0.
Yeah it’s alpha software. Even fully developed AAA titles ship with bugs. My point is they haven’t decreased my enjoyment of the game at all, and that’s a counterpoint to the meme.
Project zomboid
Deep Rock Galactic
Did i hear a Rock and Stone?
Rimworld
the more obscure one: scrap mechanic
it’s been in early access since 2016, and axolot is really slow on updates. but when they happen, it often adds a lot of cool shit.
Isn’t axolot the studio behind raft (another excellent game that was in early access for years)?
they published it, yes. redbeet developed it.
I’d say the early access of raft was better than the final release even
Same here with 7D2D I have over 1k hours on it and it’s still fresh to me.
And there’s more than one way to do EA.
KSP 1 started small and free, added more stuff and went purchase but cheap. On the other hand, KSP 2 went straight for full-price AAA game price yet lacked a ton of features and terrible performance (it was clearly rushed out).
I wonder if that has much to do with the original being made by a small startup company named Squad, while the sequel lists Intercept Games as the developer and Pirate Division as the publisher?
Likely, there was some drama with one company poaching devs from the other and the publisher doing a switcheroo.
100% the way to play video games these days.
I bought Deep Rock Galactic, Subnautica, annd Satisfactory in early access and have no regrets. These are great games and I would rather pay to be a beta tester on them than play many AAA finished pieces of junk. I think in general it’s not a bad thing to be wary about early access but I’m not sure it warrants an all or nothing approach.
Nuance? On the internet? Get the fuck out of here.
The thing is, early access games aren’t necessary unplayable.
If they are good enough in their current form to warrant the price, then that is a good time to buy them. The updates are only a bonus at that point.
But don’t buy early access for the promised features, since they may never arrive.
Yup. Palworld needs a lot of polish, but I don’t feel bad spending 25 bucks on it as it is.
As I mentioned elsewhere, valheim, 7 days to die, rust (now released!) are all worth.
2023’s darling, BG3 was in early access for years and feedback during early access made it better.
Yes, I love Larians Early Access.
You can basically play the first map all the way through, and it is so big it feels like a full game.
But then the full game releases and you’re like “holy fuck there is so much more content”.
Valheim was an absolutely soul sucking addiction for me and a couple of friends holy shit I hadn’t gamed like that in a decade.
I like soloing most survival crafters but valheim really is more fun with friends. Going sailing with the whole crew and just talking about stuff and vibing to the music is great.
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I like early access games because at least you know the game is unfinished.
And the game is making money while still being in development, so the devs can take their time without having to worry about deadlines.
Early access games can also change fundamental gameplay aspects since it’s in development, so if a feature sucks, they can just remove it.
Yup. The alternatives are pre-orders and broken games that are unplayable until the first couple of patches.
so if a feature sucks, they can just remove it
Unfortunately if you liked that feature, it is gone now.
I like the GOG approach to EA:
“Rollback in GOG GALAXY — Keep playing your game if the newest update is not doing it for you, or revisit historical version snapshots.”
https://support.gog.com/hc/en-us/articles/115000591705-Early-Access-as-it-is?product=gog
Fair, but it’s an early access game, and still in development.
Also, I didn’t know about that GOG thing. I wish that was more common.
Iirc there’s ways in steam to do the same thing, though I believe it’s a bit more involved of a process.
I used to play a ton of this game Magicite before the developer destroyed the game with its final update which came out conveniently around the release of their next game. Which they did again for that next title, and again for the one after that.
And by destroy I mean now you have a chance to soft lock in every level, picking up specific auto loot items can cause shops to permanently close up, crafting certain items cause glitchy behavior, co-op went from “minimum one person must survive each level” to “the first death causes everyone to instantly fail”, and the game crashes on the final boss fight before counting it as completed.
Every recommendation I’ve seen for this game also comes with an explanation on how to revert to the second latest version of the game.
Meanwhile, team cherry keeps adding stuff to Silksong until they run out of money
It’s going to be Silksymphony at this rate.
You can figure this out by playing the finished game years later. Why is everyone trying to keep up with the Joneses over video games??? Lol
Because they can still be great games. Rust was in early access for years but it was always playable and fun. 7 days to die is on alpha build 21 and has been in alpha for I don’t know how long but it’s amazing. Valheim was basically perfect from the start even if it was missing the whole end half of the game.
Palworld is a very good start. There’s a bunch of QOL changes and bug fixes that would improve it, but the core gameplay loop is established and the parameters are all selectable so you can tailor the difficulty as you please. Evidently the “goal” of the game is blocked off, but aside from that it’s a full game. No man’s sky and starfield were honestly less finished on release.
If the devs are good, those early access players make the game better for the people who buy when it’s fully released.
RimWorld, Subnautica, darkest dungeon, streets of rogue, project zomboid, oxygen not included, starsector, skull the hero slayer, dead cells, caves of qud quasimorph and universim are games i bought in early access that I do not regret in the slightest.
I’d say the biggest problem is these big companies who release “finished” games that are clearly not finished and the people who keep pre-ordering them
Add Baldur’s Gate 3 and Hades to the list
And Factorio as well.
Valheim, Grounded, Satisfactory
I think the problem is that it’s a gamble, and there’s always potential to get burned.
Money up front for something you really have no idea how it is, is stupid.
The biggest hypocrisy are games in early access that release a DLC before v1
Fuckin’ Ark.
I’m very anti-pre-order, but early access I’m okay with. It comes with the same decision process as buying anything else, is what I’m getting right now worth the money I’m paying? If yes, then buy it, if no then don’t. I don’t buy promises, I buy products.
Baldurs gate 3 is a good example of early access done right. I knew going in I was getting the first 4 levels and roughly 1/4 - 1/3 of the planned final game, but what was there already was worth the price I paid, even if they never finished or released it, I got my money’s worth imo. I put like 200+ hours into it before it released, i can’t be mad at that for 30 bucks.
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Wait, people are buying EA from AAA studios? Cuz like the VAST MAJORITY of EA games are Indie
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There’s nothing wrong with buying early access games. You as a buyer just need to be happy with the current state of the game at the time of purchase.
And the price should reflect the game’s current state/value, not some hypothetical roadmap.
So more like Kerbal Space Program, less like Kerbal Space Program 2.
Exactly this. I tell my friends not to get their hopes up too high about Palworlds eventually being completed because the studio has a history of abandoning titles in early access. I’m not telling them not to buy it or that it’s not worth purchasing, but to weigh if where it’s currently at is worth the price they’re charging.
The studio may use the funding they got from its spike in popularity to actually complete a title just as well as they might sell out to a bigger studio (I’d imagine The Pokemon Company would love to buy then bury it), or abandon it entirely. We don’t know what the future holds and we do know the studio has a history, so keep that in mind when you’re purchasing or when you’re asking yourself if it was worth the buy.
I’d imagine The Pokemon Company would love to buy then bury it
sighs and looks at DRM-Free versions
Which one have they abandoned? Because Craftopia still gets updates, and last year they got the open world update, which is a massive change.
I see a lot of people shitting on Craftopia saying it’s a BotW ripoff, while its fun and completely its own thing (ok, asset wise and sound wise eerily similar, but gameplay has nothing to do with BotW)
I am not sure about the pokemon company. Palworld is a completely different genre than pokemon and therefore not really a competitor.
really, do tell, what games have they abandoned in early access?
Craftopia which is basically palworld without the Pokemon aspect. I got burned by that one a few years ago which is why I’m still reluctant to pick up palworld. I think they did the same with their other game (now removed from steam), but I can’t remember the name of it.
Never grave is the one you’re thinking of
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Craftopia was updated last week and is still being actively developed but whatever you want to believe
Where does “buying it 10 years later so that it can run on whatever the modern equivalent of a teacup is” fit in?
Playing witcher 3 on steamdeck for the first time.
Relevant XKCD
This is exactly what I’m doing. Games still look great, they run great, and chances are there are a bunch of quality of life mod improvements.
Days gone released on gog not long ago, the first thing I got was the mod for silencers, what a bullshit idea to only use it for five shots and then it’s gone.
And I forgot: I never buy a GaaS! They will shut down The Crew soon, a game I play on a regular basis and one of the most relaxing titles ever made. I don’t care how great a game might be, you won’t get any money out of me ever again dear companies.
That’s how (many) suppressors work in real life though. Each shot erodes the baffles, and after no more than a dozen it’s just a flash hider.
I’m making a note here. Huge success.
It’s hard to overstate my satisfaction.
But you wouldn’t know, would you?
I did witcher 3 like 3 years ago. What a great time I had. My previous PC was barely mid tier in 2012. When I built a new one in 2019 it was a piece of cake to run in an ultra wide monitor with cranked settings.
I upgraded my PC in Oktober with a RX 7600, enough for older games, silent and efficient. I really looked forward to enjoy Witcher 3 at highest settings. A few days later rumors about Witcher 3 Next Gen. How dare they! Now I can’t push every single slider to max and enjoy 120fps!
In all seriousness: The update is great of course and I applaud CD Project Red for releasing it free. Besides the better graphics (Which even the 7600 can handle at Full HD without high RT settings) they also included tons of fixes and quality of live improvements the community made over the time. I can really recommend it.
I even bought it at full price years before I played it because I enjoyed Witcher 2 so much and was certain they will make a good game.
What’s hilarious about this is I was previously using a community mod that did all this already. The official update fucked my performance so hard I rolled it back. I couldn’t really tell a difference. They later fixed it but it does run worse still than the mod version.
I ran it on a mid range business machine from 2014 with mostly mild upgrades and a 1060 6GB. I’ve since upgraded everything but the GPU, need to have another stab but I keep playing CS2 instead. When I’m not playing that it’s TOTK on the Switch.
Ah yes, sunk a lot of hours into totk too.
I’ve only just got a computer that can play games from 2005 onwards (no kidding my netbook could handle sims 2 at the most). I’ve also started playing Witcher 3 (got the complete collection for £8) and just bought a controller the other day. I don’t care about fancy cutting edge graphics; good storyline and gaming experience is what matters.
Enjoying palworld quite a bit despite bugs, and the input (and money) will probably make the end product a better game. BG3 is another example of a game that was wildly successful due to EA.
I’ll judge these on a case by case basis. But I think the issue is less EA titles and more titles that are released not as EA but obviously broken.
And even those are a mixed bag, like Cities Skylines 2 should be in EA, but as an informed gamer i still knew what i’m going to get on day 1 and despite all the downsides it’s enjoyable and i wouldn’t choose to play C:S 1 instead
Too late. Everybody buying Palworld.
Honestly, Palworld shows how bad it is. An early access being better than many complete releases is…
Wow
Just goes to show you that “early release” is mostly just a marketing gimmick these days
Are people not having fun with Palworld? I haven’t tried it myself but the reviews are 94% positive on Steam right now.
It’s pretty shallow and buggy but people have fun with what’s there and it’s enough
I certainly got my 30 bucks worth out of it. If I can come back in a few years and find a better game with more content then that’s just a cherry on top.
It is like free DLC at that point.
The exploring and catching part of the game is very fun.
It’s pretty fun, and it’s $35. I’ve paid $90 for worse games.
Ikr. Really should have made this Jan 1st.
Nah, I’ll buy quality games whether or not they’re EA. As with everything, you have to put in the effort to find the good shit mixed in with the bad. I’ve easily had at least a half dozen EA games that I’ve bought and played hundreds of hours, and more than a half dozen “completed” games that were absolute trash. Games like KSP, Minecraft, Factorio, Satisfactory, Oxygen Not Included, and DSP are some of my most played games, and all bought during early access/pre-release. And those are just the ones that come to the top of my head lol.
When you buy something early access you have to know what you’re getting, and you have to understand this is potentially all you’re getting. With any early access game I purchased, I made sure that I’m okay with the game I purchasing and that I don’t feel like more justify my purchase. With that mentality I’ve never been disappointed in my choices for early access purchases, and the games I’ve purchased have all come a long way and some have even gotten to “completed”/1.0 level.
